Comments for SEEKING THE TRUTH IN THE WORD http://gotdiscernment.com "Then you will know the truth and the truth will set you free." John 8:32 Thu, 23 Feb 2012 00:06:49 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.2.1 Comment on The Truth About the G12 Movement by Jo-Ann http://gotdiscernment.com/2009/11/17/the-truth-about-the-g12-movement/#comment-6600 Jo-Ann Sun, 04 Sep 2011 07:55:43 +0000 http://gotdiscernment.com/2009/11/17/the-truth-about-the-g12-movement/#comment-6600 Anette, You are focusing on the people behind it but why should you do that, all of us are not perfect, that's why we have to fix our eyes on JESUS alone because if we look at men, we might get frustrated and disappointed. For your info, here in Saudi, G12 has no fee, I attended EGR (Encounter with God Retreat) last Aug. 31 to Sep 2 and I thanked the LORD for the opportunity. I was restored, healed and that's not because of pastor Cesar Castellanos but because of JESUS CHRIST and His works on the cross 2,000 years ago. We are also not told we're not belong if we dont get 12 people, and I'm now encourage to win souls for the glory of JESUS Christ alone. You know Anette, if we really look at people, we will really not grow, we will always be skeptical. As for us here in Saudi Arabia, only the Name of JESUS CHRIST has been lifted up, no fee, no condemnation if we dont get 12 and we are all restored, thanks be to GOD alone! Anette,
You are focusing on the people behind it but why should you do that, all of us are not perfect, that’s why we have to fix our eyes on JESUS alone because if we look at men, we might get frustrated and disappointed.
For your info, here in Saudi, G12 has no fee, I attended EGR (Encounter with God Retreat) last Aug. 31 to Sep 2 and I thanked the LORD for the opportunity. I was restored, healed and that’s not because of pastor Cesar Castellanos but because of JESUS CHRIST and His works on the cross 2,000 years ago. We are also not told we’re not belong if we dont get 12 people, and I’m now encourage to win souls for the glory of JESUS Christ alone. You know Anette, if we really look at people, we will really not grow, we will always be skeptical. As for us here in Saudi Arabia, only the Name of JESUS CHRIST has been lifted up, no fee, no condemnation if we dont get 12 and we are all restored, thanks be to GOD alone!

]]> Comment on The Truth About the G12 Movement by james gunt http://gotdiscernment.com/2009/11/17/the-truth-about-the-g12-movement/#comment-5577 james gunt Wed, 20 Jul 2011 02:17:36 +0000 http://gotdiscernment.com/2009/11/17/the-truth-about-the-g12-movement/#comment-5577 Good day everyone. For me, i believe that God's main purpose is to win souls for Him, to seek those who were lost and to go to the world and preach the gospel, for the harvest is plenty but the laborers are few. And that no matter what their motives may be (the persons behind or leaders of this G12 as they say), or mistakes they have done-for nobody is perfect, but the most important thing is that the gospel has been preached. just what Paul said in Philippians Chapter 1 Verse 15: some indeed preach Christ even from envy and strife, and some also for goodwill: Verse 16: The former preach Christ form selfish ambition,not sincerely, supposing to add affliction to my chains; Verse 17: but the latter out of love, knowing that I am appointed for the defense of the gospel. Verse 18: What then? Only that in every way, whether in pretense or in truth, Christ is preached; and in this I rejoice, yes, and will rejoice. Therefore for everyone of us, let us not criticize them or any person involve in G12 for we are already Christians, and our main role as a Christian is to spread out the good news of Salvation and not to criticize G12 or its leaders or any other movement that brought souls to the Lord. If that's their way of winning souls for Christ then be it, support it, and be happy for it, for in every soul that receives Christ as their Saviour there are thousands of angels rejoicing in heaven. So let's just be happy for the souls that received Christ and in whatever vessel or way that brought them to the Lord, whether its by music, arts, entertainment, cellgroup, crusades, G12 and etc. Praise God...regards Good day everyone. For me, i believe that God’s main purpose is to win souls for Him, to seek those who were lost and to go to the world and preach the gospel, for the harvest is plenty but the laborers are few.

And that no matter what their motives may be (the persons behind or leaders of this G12 as they say), or mistakes they have done-for nobody is perfect, but the most important thing is that the gospel has been preached.

just what Paul said in Philippians Chapter 1

Verse 15: some indeed preach Christ even from envy and strife, and some also for goodwill:

Verse 16: The former preach Christ form selfish ambition,not sincerely, supposing to add affliction to my chains;

Verse 17: but the latter out of love, knowing that I am appointed for the defense of the gospel.

Verse 18: What then? Only that in every way, whether in pretense or in truth, Christ is preached; and in this I rejoice, yes, and will rejoice.

Therefore for everyone of us, let us not criticize them or any person involve in G12 for we are already Christians, and our main role as a Christian is to spread out the good news of Salvation and not to criticize G12 or its leaders or any other movement that brought souls to the Lord.

If that’s their way of winning souls for Christ then be it, support it, and be happy for it, for in every soul that receives Christ as their Saviour there are thousands of angels rejoicing in heaven.

So let’s just be happy for the souls that received Christ and in whatever vessel or way that brought them to the Lord, whether its by music, arts, entertainment, cellgroup, crusades, G12 and etc.

Praise God…regards

]]> Comment on The Truth About the G12 Movement by Mark http://gotdiscernment.com/2009/11/17/the-truth-about-the-g12-movement/#comment-4834 Mark Mon, 13 Jun 2011 09:54:56 +0000 http://gotdiscernment.com/2009/11/17/the-truth-about-the-g12-movement/#comment-4834 Hi Annette, I agree with most of your points. I was once a member of a congregation that is a member of the G12. I just remembered when i ask the pastor if we can conduct a thorough study of the G12 movement. He refused and told me just to accept it because he had already studied it. I was even charged of something in front of my brothers just to avoid the idea i presented. I was forced to believe in the movement and to be a part of the movement. (You will be labeled as rebellious if you will not.) But then after months of observing the movement and studying the scripture, i decided not to involve in the movement anymore. Then when i was asked by the Pastor to see Him, i told Him that i don't believe that the G12 is sciptural and i don't believe that it is truly a revelation by God to Pastor Castellanos. The Pastor can't even give me a straight answer if he believes that it is truly a revelation fron God. (makes me confused as to why he decided to take a part of the movement.) What i received was "I fasted for 12 days for that!". He just did not answer the question. I also agree with Joy that what matters most is a persons relationship to the Lord. BUT i don't agree with her next statement. I believe, a person will encounter God the moment He wants it, in His ways, in His time, and in the place He chooses. Not on a time/placed scheduled by humans, that is not even scriptural. (-Isaiah, Jacob, Paul, etc) And the leadership trainings and personal growth of a Christian is the duty of a Pastor/Christian so there's nothing new to that. You don't need the G12 to do that. Blessings, Mark Hi Annette,

I agree with most of your points. I was once a member of a congregation that is a member of the G12. I just remembered when i ask the pastor if we can conduct a thorough study of the G12 movement. He refused and told me just to accept it because he had already studied it. I was even charged of something in front of my brothers just to avoid the idea i presented. I was forced to believe in the movement and to be a part of the movement. (You will be labeled as rebellious if you will not.) But then after months of observing the movement and studying the scripture, i decided not to involve in the movement anymore. Then when i was asked by the Pastor to see Him, i told Him that i don’t believe that the G12 is sciptural and i don’t believe that it is truly a revelation by God to Pastor Castellanos. The Pastor can’t even give me a straight answer if he believes that it is truly a revelation fron God. (makes me confused as to why he decided to take a part of the movement.) What i received was “I fasted for 12 days for that!”. He just did not answer the question.

I also agree with Joy that what matters most is a persons relationship to the Lord. BUT i don’t agree with her next statement. I believe, a person will encounter God the moment He wants it, in His ways, in His time, and in the place He chooses. Not on a time/placed scheduled by humans, that is not even scriptural. (-Isaiah, Jacob, Paul, etc) And the leadership trainings and personal growth of a Christian is the duty of a Pastor/Christian so there’s nothing new to that. You don’t need the G12 to do that.

Blessings,
Mark

]]> Comment on The Truth About the G12 Movement by Annette Colon-Alvarenga http://gotdiscernment.com/2009/11/17/the-truth-about-the-g12-movement/#comment-4705 Annette Colon-Alvarenga Wed, 08 Jun 2011 04:45:52 +0000 http://gotdiscernment.com/2009/11/17/the-truth-about-the-g12-movement/#comment-4705 To date I have been very careful about my comments. I believe that in my article I am very specific in saying that the strategies work. They have been implemented in many churches under different names (don't think that the Castellanos were the first to start small groups). Obviously, each church must modify how the encounters, school of leadership and cell groups are structured to fit it's congregation. And, of course, no church is perfect. That goes without saying. Now, I will lose some of my gentleness. If anyone who has posted here has read the books by Cesar and Claudia Castellanos and their claims of visions and revelations and you don't see anything wrong with what they claim, then you need to start praying for discernment. Cesar Castellanos claims to have been given a revelation by God that mirrors God's revelation to Abraham. If you read the 1966 book, The Master Plan of Evangelism, you will note that when Billy Graham is asked about how he would develop a plan of discipleship, Graham reveals the same plan (in the 1960's) that Castellanos claims was revealed to him by God in the 1980's. Then there's Cesar's claim that God gave Abraham the "Revelation of the Cross" at the time he was to sacrifice his son Isaac. Cesar is doing what was is prohibited, he is adding to God's revelation in His Word. This statement and his story of how it happened is nothing but heresy. Now I'll move on to Claudia's incredible stories. First, in the Revelation of the Cross, there is an account of Claudia's spirit being transported to the cross at the exact moment of Christ's crucifixion. She claims to have experienced everything our Lord experienced on the Cross. Blasphemy! As if that wasn't enough, she later states that while on a visit to Israel she received a revelation that she should be baptized by a man at the river Jordan, a man who when his mother was pregnant was supposedly told that the child she was carrying would have the ministry of John the Baptist (you know, the "voice of the one crying in the wilderness: 'Prepare the way for the Lord, make straight paths for him.'" She then states that upon finding the man, he baptizes her and as she rises from the water she sees the heavens open and the spirit of God descends upon her and she hears the voice of God saying, "This is my daughter in whom I am well pleased." There is only one word for this: BLASPHEMY! If these are the Pastors providing a "covering" over your pastors and church, there's a problem (yes, if your church is paying their $1200 monthly franchise fee to G12, they are said to be under the "covering" of Cesar and Claudia Castellanos.) You need to understand the structure of MCI and the G12 hierarchy. Perhaps I am able to understand it better because I was involved from it's inception in the United States and because the hispanic pastors who first "joined" G12 in SoCal and were part of Castellanos' "12" here are pastors I know well. All you can do is pray for your church and its leaders. But how anyone can sit and listen to the heresy and the blasphemy, that I cannot understand. Don't be afraid to respond to this comment. I will post all comments, so long as they meet rules of decency. To date I have been very careful about my comments. I believe that in my article I am very specific in saying that the strategies work. They have been implemented in many churches under different names (don’t think that the Castellanos were the first to start small groups). Obviously, each church must modify how the encounters, school of leadership and cell groups are structured to fit it’s congregation. And, of course, no church is perfect. That goes without saying.

Now, I will lose some of my gentleness. If anyone who has posted here has read the books by Cesar and Claudia Castellanos and their claims of visions and revelations and you don’t see anything wrong with what they claim, then you need to start praying for discernment.

Cesar Castellanos claims to have been given a revelation by God that mirrors God’s revelation to Abraham. If you read the 1966 book, The Master Plan of Evangelism, you will note that when Billy Graham is asked about how he would develop a plan of discipleship, Graham reveals the same plan (in the 1960’s) that Castellanos claims was revealed to him by God in the 1980’s. Then there’s Cesar’s claim that God gave Abraham the “Revelation of the Cross” at the time he was to sacrifice his son Isaac. Cesar is doing what was is prohibited, he is adding to God’s revelation in His Word. This statement and his story of how it happened is nothing but heresy.

Now I’ll move on to Claudia’s incredible stories. First, in the Revelation of the Cross, there is an account of Claudia’s spirit being transported to the cross at the exact moment of Christ’s crucifixion. She claims to have experienced everything our Lord experienced on the Cross. Blasphemy!

As if that wasn’t enough, she later states that while on a visit to Israel she received a revelation that she should be baptized by a man at the river Jordan, a man who when his mother was pregnant was supposedly told that the child she was carrying would have the ministry of John the Baptist (you know, the “voice of the one crying in the wilderness: ‘Prepare the way for the Lord, make straight paths for him.’” She then states that upon finding the man, he baptizes her and as she rises from the water she sees the heavens open and the spirit of God descends upon her and she hears the voice of God saying, “This is my daughter in whom I am well pleased.” There is only one word for this: BLASPHEMY!

If these are the Pastors providing a “covering” over your pastors and church, there’s a problem (yes, if your church is paying their $1200 monthly franchise fee to G12, they are said to be under the “covering” of Cesar and Claudia Castellanos.) You need to understand the structure of MCI and the G12 hierarchy. Perhaps I am able to understand it better because I was involved from it’s inception in the United States and because the hispanic pastors who first “joined” G12 in SoCal and were part of Castellanos’ “12″ here are pastors I know well.

All you can do is pray for your church and its leaders. But how anyone can sit and listen to the heresy and the blasphemy, that I cannot understand.

Don’t be afraid to respond to this comment. I will post all comments, so long as they meet rules of decency.

]]> Comment on Drawing Near To God by Annette Colon-Alvarenga http://gotdiscernment.com/2010/02/12/drawing-near-to-god/#comment-4704 Annette Colon-Alvarenga Wed, 08 Jun 2011 04:03:34 +0000 http://gotdiscernment.com/2010/02/12/drawing-near-to-god/#comment-4704 Bendiciones Pastores Jose e Ysabel! I have not translated my articles to Spanish as of yet. If you are most interested in the G12 article, I will work on the translation and, once it is ready, email it to you if you'd like. Thank you for visiting this site. By the way, I am also Puerto Rican raised in southern California. But every chance I get, I go back to the Island. I still have most of my family there (and actually have one cousin getting her medical degree in Santo Domingo). God's richest blessings to you both and your congregation. I will let you know once the translation is complete. Annette. Bendiciones Pastores Jose e Ysabel! I have not translated my articles to Spanish as of yet. If you are most interested in the G12 article, I will work on the translation and, once it is ready, email it to you if you’d like. Thank you for visiting this site. By the way, I am also Puerto Rican raised in southern California. But every chance I get, I go back to the Island. I still have most of my family there (and actually have one cousin getting her medical degree in Santo Domingo).

God’s richest blessings to you both and your congregation.

I will let you know once the translation is complete.

Annette.

]]> Comment on The Truth About the G12 Movement by Joy http://gotdiscernment.com/2009/11/17/the-truth-about-the-g12-movement/#comment-4454 Joy Wed, 25 May 2011 11:21:53 +0000 http://gotdiscernment.com/2009/11/17/the-truth-about-the-g12-movement/#comment-4454 Good day, I'm a Christian attending a G12 church. I think that what matters the most is that a person establishes a strong and healthy relationship with the Lord. The G12 vision gives people the opportunity to experience Encounters and leadership trainings for the purpose of their own personal growth in Christ. And it's very true that some people, even pastors, make mistakes and that's because we're not perfect as human beings. I believe that everyone, especially pastors, should be really connected with the Lord and in daily communication with Him. As a member of our G12 churches, I admire my pastors. Everything we have we know is from the Lord and still belongs to Him. I am a cell group leader and our pastors remind us again and again that the people in church do not belong to us but to God. We are just good stewards of the people that God placed in our care. As for the G12 system, it's not perfect. If it is, then we wouldn't need God any more. Right now, God reveals new things to many churches, new paths and new strategies to make. No church or system is perfect. The people in church, not just the pastors but every member of the congregation, do their best to make the system work. It's a collective effort, a teamwork with the Holy Spirit. And us? we are not perfect, we just need to be the best "we" that we can be, through the guidance of the Lord and through our willingness and love to serve Him. Annette, you are at the receiving end of the preachings and ministering. there will always be something to say against a system, there will always be problems with it but im emploring and asking you, what did you do to fix the problem? when I first came to G12, i hated it. I saw so many errors in the system, then I asked the Lord for a Word. Is this really the place for me? and God said yes. Over the years, I saw the system improved and I was just glad that I stayed and I'm one of the people that helped the church improve in the process. Remember: Ephesians 6: 12 'For we are not fighting against flesh-and-blood enemies, but against evil rulers and authorities of the unseen world, against mighty powers in this dark world, and against evil spirits in the heavenly places.' My church is not perfect. The pastors are not perfect. I am not perfect. But I am not giving up. If there is something wrong, point it out and help in finding the solution. I'm glad I'm fighting for the Lord until the very end. God bless to you :) Good day,

I’m a Christian attending a G12 church. I think that what matters the most is that a person establishes a strong and healthy relationship with the Lord. The G12 vision gives people the opportunity to experience Encounters and leadership trainings for the purpose of their own personal growth in Christ. And it’s very true that some people, even pastors, make mistakes and that’s because we’re not perfect as human beings. I believe that everyone, especially pastors, should be really connected with the Lord and in daily communication with Him.

As a member of our G12 churches, I admire my pastors. Everything we have we know is from the Lord and still belongs to Him. I am a cell group leader and our pastors remind us again and again that the people in church do not belong to us but to God. We are just good stewards of the people that God placed in our care. As for the G12 system, it’s not perfect. If it is, then we wouldn’t need God any more. Right now, God reveals new things to many churches, new paths and new strategies to make. No church or system is perfect. The people in church, not just the pastors but every member of the congregation, do their best to make the system work. It’s a collective effort, a teamwork with the Holy Spirit. And us? we are not perfect, we just need to be the best “we” that we can be, through the guidance of the Lord and through our willingness and love to serve Him.

Annette,
you are at the receiving end of the preachings and ministering. there will always be something to say against a system, there will always be problems with it but im emploring and asking you, what did you do to fix the problem? when I first came to G12, i hated it. I saw so many errors in the system, then I asked the Lord for a Word. Is this really the place for me? and God said yes. Over the years, I saw the system improved and I was just glad that I stayed and I’m one of the people that helped the church improve in the process.
Remember:
Ephesians 6: 12
‘For we are not fighting against flesh-and-blood enemies, but against evil rulers and authorities of the unseen world, against mighty powers in this dark world, and against evil spirits in the heavenly places.’

My church is not perfect. The pastors are not perfect. I am not perfect. But I am not giving up. If there is something wrong, point it out and help in finding the solution. I’m glad I’m fighting for the Lord until the very end.

God bless to you :)

]]> Comment on Drawing Near To God by Pastores Jose A. e Ysabel Quintero http://gotdiscernment.com/2010/02/12/drawing-near-to-god/#comment-4144 Pastores Jose A. e Ysabel Quintero Sun, 08 May 2011 16:47:39 +0000 http://gotdiscernment.com/2010/02/12/drawing-near-to-god/#comment-4144 Blessings: Do you have the articles in Spanish? I would love to share the ones from G12, because I found them very very balanced and that was my experience too. Be blessed. Pd. We're pastors in the Dominican Republic where my wife's from (I'm Puerto Rican raised in the US). Blessings: Do you have the articles in Spanish? I would love to share the ones from G12, because I found them very very balanced and that was my experience too. Be blessed.
Pd. We’re pastors in the Dominican Republic where my wife’s from (I’m Puerto Rican raised in the US).

]]> Comment on The Truth About the G12 Movement by Sanctified http://gotdiscernment.com/2009/11/17/the-truth-about-the-g12-movement/#comment-2912 Sanctified Wed, 16 Mar 2011 08:51:54 +0000 http://gotdiscernment.com/2009/11/17/the-truth-about-the-g12-movement/#comment-2912 Acts 5:35-39 35 Then he addressed the Sanhedrin: “Men of Israel, consider carefully what you intend to do to these men. 36 Some time ago Theudas appeared, claiming to be somebody, and about four hundred men rallied to him. He was killed, all his followers were dispersed, and it all came to nothing. 37 After him, Judas the Galilean appeared in the days of the census and led a band of people in revolt. He too was killed, and all his followers were scattered. 38 Therefore, in the present case I advise you: Leave these men alone! Let them go! For if their purpose or activity is of human origin, it will fail. 39 But if it is from God, you will not be able to stop these men; you will only find yourselves fighting against God.” Also try to look it up from verses 17-39. Acts 5:35-39

35 Then he addressed the Sanhedrin: “Men of Israel, consider carefully what you intend to do to these men.

36 Some time ago Theudas appeared, claiming to be somebody, and about four hundred men rallied to him. He was killed, all his followers were dispersed, and it all came to nothing.

37 After him, Judas the Galilean appeared in the days of the census and led a band of people in revolt. He too was killed, and all his followers were scattered.

38 Therefore, in the present case I advise you: Leave these men alone! Let them go! For if their purpose or activity is of human origin, it will fail.

39 But if it is from God, you will not be able to stop these men; you will only find yourselves fighting against God.”

Also try to look it up from verses 17-39.

]]> Comment on The Truth About the G12 Movement by Mo http://gotdiscernment.com/2009/11/17/the-truth-about-the-g12-movement/#comment-1191 Mo Sun, 14 Nov 2010 03:48:40 +0000 http://gotdiscernment.com/2009/11/17/the-truth-about-the-g12-movement/#comment-1191 Hi, well first off I want to say that I am a Christian. I have been walking with the Lord for many years now. I do not attend a G12 church, nor do I feel any inclination to, however I was at that event in the Anaheim convention center in 2009. I attended for other reasons, I had to work at the event. I can vouch for everything you said that happened at the event. What bugs me the most is that all the preachers are very dogmatic about sticking to the whole 12 thing and even come off as saying if you're not part of the 12 thing then you are not going to be blessed by God. Also the whole offering thing is something I have seen before. I use to attend a hyper-Pentecostal church and they would do that. I don't like that at all. Thata why people in the world see the church and only see the money hungry preachers. I am a believer in the practicality of the gospel which many seem to toss aside and only focus on the "spiritual" aspect of the gospel. But anyways that's just my little rant. Hi, well first off I want to say that I am a Christian. I have been walking with the Lord for many years now. I do not attend a G12 church, nor do I feel any inclination to, however I was at that event in the Anaheim convention center in 2009. I attended for other reasons, I had to work at the event. I can vouch for everything you said that happened at the event. What bugs me the most is that all the preachers are very dogmatic about sticking to the whole 12 thing and even come off as saying if you’re not part of the 12 thing then you are not going to be blessed by God. Also the whole offering thing is something I have seen before. I use to attend a hyper-Pentecostal church and they would do that. I don’t like that at all. Thata why people in the world see the church and only see the money hungry preachers. I am a believer in the practicality of the gospel which many seem to toss aside and only focus on the “spiritual” aspect of the gospel. But anyways that’s just my little rant.

]]> Comment on The Truth About the G12 Movement by Shushuana http://gotdiscernment.com/2009/11/17/the-truth-about-the-g12-movement/#comment-1102 Shushuana Thu, 22 Jul 2010 23:21:48 +0000 http://gotdiscernment.com/2009/11/17/the-truth-about-the-g12-movement/#comment-1102 Annette - I am currently attending pastor Rich Witmers G12 church which is in Yuma Az and I see what you are talking about. As in every church you have those who have a heart to bring the love of God to those who have never known Him and those who are in it for either Paycheck or the fame and attention. My husband and I have been going to Generations for 3 years now and we love the church and those in it. I grew up going to a Jehovah witness church til I was 8 when they kicked my mother out of the church for smoking, I remember being in meetings where my mother left crying. For years me and my husband went to churches in Oakland ca area one after the other where we were asked that when we came back if we could dress more appropriatly. We went to a penticosal church for a while until they asked my husband to cut his hair and for me to not wear makeup and pants. Yes like every church the G12 Vision does have those who become involved and corrupt the purpose of the vision. I hve seen people leave the church over stupid reasons, like they were still doing drugs and the cell leader refused to move them into their 12. I've known other people leave a church here in town and start to go to a different one because they percieved the pastor didn't like them. Another person left another popular church here in town because that church told them to stop doing band gigs outside of church or they would have to leave. Anything to bring people closer to God is great and unfortunatly the devil will do all he can to prevent that. Most of today's churches are full of weekenders, monthly guilt trippers or holiday goers. My husband and I love our church becase there is structure that helps us come closer to God which we never got in the ten years of church hunting. My encounter experiance was not as spectacular as yours, but it helped me open my heart more so God could work a positive change in me. Yes some people throw the word rebellious around like confette. Always remember that what ever you do or don't do is a choice. If what your leader is suing is not biblically sound it's not from God. Check out Rich Witmers blog, yes he does speak his mind without fear, which I find refreshing. Also check out our services at world on fire .com they r live Saturday 6pm westcoast and Sunday 10am. If anything the sermons are great!!! How far in School of Leaders did you get btw? Annette - I am currently attending pastor Rich Witmers G12 church which is in Yuma Az and I see what you are talking about. As in every church you have those who have a heart to bring the love of God to those who have never known Him and those who are in it for either Paycheck or the fame and attention. My husband and I have been going to Generations for 3 years now and we love the church and those in it.

I grew up going to a Jehovah witness church til I was 8 when they kicked my mother out of the church for smoking, I remember being in meetings where my mother left crying. For years me and my husband went to churches in Oakland ca area one after the other where we were asked that when we came back if we could dress more appropriatly. We went to a penticosal church for a while until they asked my husband to cut his hair and for me to not wear makeup and pants.

Yes like every church the G12 Vision does have those who become involved and corrupt the purpose of the vision. I hve seen people leave the church over stupid reasons, like they were still doing drugs and the cell leader refused to move them into their 12. I’ve known other people leave a church here in town and start to go to a different one because they percieved the pastor didn’t like them. Another person left another popular church here in town because that church told them to stop doing band gigs outside of church or they would have to leave.

Anything to bring people closer to God is great and unfortunatly the devil will do all he can to prevent that. Most of today’s churches are full of weekenders, monthly guilt trippers or holiday goers. My husband and I love our church becase there is structure that helps us come closer to God which we never got in the ten years of church hunting. My encounter experiance was not as spectacular as yours, but it helped me open my heart more so God could work a positive change in me. Yes some people throw the word rebellious around like confette. Always remember that what ever you do or don’t do is a choice. If what your leader is suing is not biblically sound it’s not from God.
Check out Rich Witmers blog, yes he does speak his mind without fear, which I find refreshing.
Also check out our services at world on fire .com
they r live Saturday 6pm westcoast and Sunday 10am. If anything the sermons are great!!!

How far in School of Leaders did you get btw?

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